It's official

"BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather" (bugeyedacura) 07/06/2017 at 21:17 • Filed to: None

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The CTR is faster than the Golf R and the Focus RS around The Nurburgring, and evenly splits the twos’ 0-60 times. Oh and it’s 5k cheaper (before dealer markup). Seriously, where is all that “advantage” they were supposed to have with AWD?

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

C62030 > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:18

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The want is strong. And the looks really don’t bother me.

BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:20

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The first Civic Type R (the blue auction one) now adorns my MacBook’s background. It replaced the BMW 320i as my wallpaper. That’s how much I love it. (I’d still take the 320i, but the Civic is flashier as a wallpaper)

EDIT: Proof (it’s been up for a month now)

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:21

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Again, track times don’t matter. It’s been panned by several reviewers for a reason.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:21

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Does not matter how fast/nice/cool the Honda products would ever be, I refuse to even be a passenger in a Honda powered vehicle until a Honda power unit puts and F1 driver on the podium at an F1 Grand Prix.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:24

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And it’s still butt ugly

TheHondaBro > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 07/06/2017 at 21:28

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Flex my boost > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:29

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Ummmm. RS all things!

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:30

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The CTR starts at $34,775 while the Focus RS starts at $36,120. That’s only a $1,345 difference. The Golf R is $35,665 (only $890 more than the CTR). Once you start ticking options they all end up costing about the same.

TheHondaBro > BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo 07/06/2017 at 21:30

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I have a Nurburgring shot as my laptop’s background.

WilliamsSW > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:31

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I *think* I saw one on my way home today (does any other civic have 3 exhaust tips?). It was grey, and I kinda like it- despite being too old for it.

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 07/06/2017 at 21:32

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Seriously, take it off the clean track and onto something with a bit of dust on it and the RS and the Golf R will eat it for breakfast.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/06/2017 at 21:33

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And just driving enjoyment wise.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 07/06/2017 at 21:35

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Who has panned it? All the reviews I’ve seen have sang its praises. The only time I see anyone criticize it is when the author clearly has a pre-bias against FWD cars. And even then it’s usually a good review.

TheHondaBro > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:35

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No use trying to defend the car here. It might as well be a 1,700 horsepower AWD monster with a 0-60 time of 2.0 seconds, a top speed of 300 MPH, and a Nurburgring time of 6:00 and people will still hate it just because it’s a Honda and because they don’t like the way it looks.

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 07/06/2017 at 21:36

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Every review I have read gives me the impression that the CTR is just a Toyota Corolla with more power while the others are actually exciting. If I am dropping $30k+ on a hot hatch I want to be having fun.

theloudmouth > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:36

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There are these two things that happen, they’re called rain and snow. They make all FWD cars as fun as a case of syphillus.

Sincerely, former Integra GSR, current Mk7 GTI owner, and swearing never to make the mistake of FWD again.

Bman76 (hates WS6 hoods, is on his phone and has 4 burners now) > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:40

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and I’d still rather have either of the other two.

TheHondaBro > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/06/2017 at 21:40

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The VW? Nope. The Focus? Maybe, but half the knobs and switches are going to rattle out of their sockets when you do.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/06/2017 at 21:49

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Your info is old and skewed. For 2017 there’s only one trim of Golf R and it costs $39,375 or $4500 more. And to get all the options on the RS that come standard on the CTR, it adds up to $40,475, or $5700 more.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > theloudmouth 07/06/2017 at 21:50

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If you’re scared, go to church.

interstate366, now In The Industry > TheHondaBro 07/06/2017 at 21:50

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THIS

interstate366, now In The Industry > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 07/06/2017 at 21:51

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neat

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/06/2017 at 21:51

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The only thing I’ve seen remotely like that is that the exhaust is too quiet for what it is.

Making a mountain out of a molehill doesn’t make you right.

interstate366, now In The Industry > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 21:53

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You get out of here with your facts and your evidence and your reasonable take!

interstate366, now In The Industry > theloudmouth 07/06/2017 at 21:54

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My Prelude is a blast to drive in rain and snow. Sounds like either those cars in particular or a driver thing.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > interstate366, now In The Industry 07/06/2017 at 21:55

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Dammit. If Honda had only put a “DRIFT MODE” button in the car! Dammit Honda! Think of the children!!

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > interstate366, now In The Industry 07/06/2017 at 21:56

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I had a GSR and a Beetle R-Line, both were a hoot to drive in the snow. I think it’s probably a driver issue.

interstate366, now In The Industry > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 22:00

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Agreed. I originally had just “sounds like a driver issue” but added the other part in there to tone it down.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > interstate366, now In The Industry 07/06/2017 at 22:02

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I almost dropped the “Grab your scan tool, I think the car’s throwing an ID-10-T” but thought it may be too mean.

Textured Soy Protein > theloudmouth 07/06/2017 at 22:06

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Except the CTR has a helical gearset LSD unlike those cars.

TheHondaBro > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 22:07

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I hate all these electronic nannies but I also want my car to make drifting easier electronically!

FTTOHG Has Moved to https://opposite-lock.com > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 07/06/2017 at 22:08

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It’s not like the segment is exactly brimming with good-looking cars. The Focus RS is hideous and the Golf R is bland. On looks alone I’d take the CTR every time.

TheHondaBro > FTTOHG Has Moved to https://opposite-lock.com 07/06/2017 at 22:10

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I saw a Focus RS the other day. It has a man bun!

interstate366, now In The Industry > WilliamsSW 07/06/2017 at 22:17

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I’ll be in my mid 30s when I pay my TSX off (31 now, got a 4-year loan but aiming to pay it off in 2 or 3), and I plan to buy one afterward. The Car Throttle review said they’re planning to make them until at least 2021. Heck, my dad is in his mid 50s and loves them.

FTTOHG Has Moved to https://opposite-lock.com > TheHondaBro 07/06/2017 at 22:22

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Exactly. The Focus RS looks like a sparkly blue catfish, is built on a platform that dates back to 2004 and a model that has been out since 2010, has an engine that shares a block with a 2001 Ranger, and is inexplicably packaged in a way that leaves next to space in both the rear seats and cargo area so that it isn’t nearly as practical as other hot hatches. But point this out and you just get called a Honda Fanboy.

WilliamsSW > interstate366, now In The Industry 07/06/2017 at 22:27

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Oh, I’m just kidding about being too old, but at 49, I’m not the target market for it.

But really, I’ve always been a fan of cars that went faster than they looked - I like the Chevy SS for exactly that reason.

But for whatever reason, I like this thing. And any time a carmaker builds something exciting, that’s good for all of us—

Saracen > FTTOHG Has Moved to https://opposite-lock.com 07/06/2017 at 22:47

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The Golf R is handsome. The RS is a bit overwrought, but the CTR is a fucking mess.

Saracen > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 22:50

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Ok. Enjoy your hideous ass-dragger.

C62030 > TheHondaBro 07/06/2017 at 22:50

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God DAMMIT I CAN NEVER UNSEE THAT

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 23:02

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Didn’t know they killed the lower trim on the Golf R. That moves it into the too pricey category.

What features does the CTR have that the Focus RS doesn’t come with? Only thing I could find in Honda’s specs was heated mirrors. Sure that requires the RS 2 package to get on the RS but the RS 2 package also gets you leather, power seats, heated seats and steering wheel, all features I can’t find anywhere on Honda’s spec list for the Type R .

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 23:14

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Most comparisons between the CTR and the RS that I have read conclude that the CTR is a quick car but lacks the engagement and excitement of the RS on the road.

Bryan doesn't drive a 1M > TheHondaBro 07/06/2017 at 23:18

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Oh no, can’t unsee. You’re a bad person.

itschrome > theloudmouth 07/06/2017 at 23:19

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What? FWD is a champ in wet and ice. Sure you just didnt buy shitty tires? Or at least not appropriate tures for weather?

Flex my boost > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 23:22

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Really? Can’t get my comment approved when all I said was RS all things. All I want for Christmas my Flex EB RS’d

Your boy, BJR > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 23:24

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Ugh. It’s just so overstyled to the point that it doesn’t even look like a car. I have trouble with the new civic in general for that reason. There just seems to be no rhyme or reason to the styling. I feel the same way about the Focus RS, Subaru STI, and different but equally negative towards the Golf R

For a mid $30ks car, I’d just get something that looks awesome and is actually a cool car *COUGHSCATPACKCHALLENGERCOUGH*

But I don’t see the point in Hot hatches, because, at the end of the day, it will still be an economy car.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Saracen 07/06/2017 at 23:33

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Don’t you threaten me with a good time.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 23:38

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Well no shit a CTR is faster around the Nurburgring than some crummy hatchbacks. In fact for several years it was faster around than all other road cars.

bob and john > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/06/2017 at 23:42

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unlike most here, I like the way it looks...

but “Seriously, where is all that “advantage” they were supposed to have with AWD?”

come on guy, even you cant be that dumb. throw anything resembling not-ideal-conditions and the civic will just wheel spin. fun wheel spin most likely...but wheel spin none the less.  

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > TheHondaBro 07/06/2017 at 23:43

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I meant again, jeez, you lot are so pedantic grammatically speaking.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/06/2017 at 23:51

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Nav comes standard on the CTR, which either has to be added individually or as the RS2 Package on the RS. Not to mention the standard Apple CarPlay and Android Auto on the CTR.

And in your original number set, you factored the RS base price without freight, and the CTR with. When apples to apples, the base price difference is over $2k.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/06/2017 at 23:54

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It lacks the excitement because it has higher limits. The car is too capable by comparison, meaning everyday life is mundane.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 03:42

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at least the other two options dont come factory riced out

theloudmouth > itschrome 07/07/2017 at 06:40

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I’m comparing it to my AWD Saabaru 9-2x Aero which was a blast any time the weather was slightly imperfect. For the record, my integra had Blizzaks and the GTI has Conti Winter Contacts. My Integra was better than my GTI for sure due to its power band lending itself to FWD, but still not ideal.

random001 > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 07:00

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You’re comparing two hatchbacks to a sedan. Get out of here with your useless comparo!

theloudmouth > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 07:31

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What?

theloudmouth > Textured Soy Protein 07/07/2017 at 07:35

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I had everything done to my Integra, coil overs, full urethane bushing replacement, etc etc,. My point is simply that in inclement weather AWD is immeasurably more fun. I have a Quaife in my 335is so believe me I get it, my point is just that try as one might the basic physics of a FWD car become maddening under weight transfer. Plus having to manage power rather than use it when you want may be a skill but it’s also a total buzzkill, and I’m no power junkie either. This morning it was pouring on the way into work and once again my GTI was a frustration. Granted I don’t have the performance pack with LSD so I can’t totally say it wouldn’t matter as I know how much difference an LSD makes before and after, but I became so spoiled by a fun AWD car that the driving feels neutered now.

PWRandSPD > theloudmouth 07/07/2017 at 08:00

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I tend to agree with others, you just have crappy tires. I have had many vehicles, RWD, AWD, FWD and as long as you have the right shoes on them you are fine. My VW, I had a MKV but would have a MK7 in a heart beat. The VW was a tank in the snow with snow tires, seriously, it was fantastic. Now the stock rubber that came on that car, the Continentals I believe they were sucked. I mean they were awful and I replaced them as soon as that first winter season came. I put winters on and the next spring I put on dedicated summer performance tires. With the right shoes, it handled all conditions fantastic. On another note, t goes the other way too, I had an STI that came with summer performance tires, they were great in the dry and wet, but when there was literally a dusting of snow, I could not get it to move on a level driveway. It’s that little contact patch of rubber that meets the road that matters, it can make a huge difference.

Arrivederci > TheHondaBro 07/07/2017 at 08:10

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ROFL!

Arrivederci > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 08:13

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Where’s the option on the CTR for AWD? Hard to compare them when all aren’t actually equipped the same, mechanically or otherwise. When/if Honda makes one with AWD, do you think it’ll cost the same?

Arrivederci > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 08:21

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How does the CTR split the FoRS and Golf R 0-60 times? The article you linked says the CTR does 4.9, quick Google-fu says the FoRS does 4.6 and a Golf R does it in 4.5 .

MR2_FTW - Group J's resident Stig > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 08:30

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It’s still ugly as sin and sounds like a whole lot of nothing. At least the FoRS and Golf R look good and sound awesome.

Eury - AFRICA TWIN!!!!!!! > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 08:37

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Maybe it’s the old man in me, but I can’t figure out why I should care about how fast a car goes around the Nurburgring. I’ve never been on my commute and suddenly found myself transported there.

That said, the Civic is hideous. It’s like someone gave 1990s Pontiac designers meth and Mountain Dew and told them to go nuts.

theloudmouth > PWRandSPD 07/07/2017 at 08:56

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I completely understand tires. I don’t know why everyone insists on comparing apples to oranges. I had snow tires on my WRX and I have snow tires on my GTI. I had “performance” all seasons on my WRX and I have them on my GTI (I wasn’t going to buy dedicated summer tires for a lease and whenever it’s sunny I drive my 335is on Pilot Super Sports). My GTI is great in the snow on snow tires in terms of getting stuck, my point was simply that it’s nowehere close to the fun my WRX was, and goes for rain on equivalent tires.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Arrivederci 07/07/2017 at 09:20

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The only way the Golf R does it in 4.5 is with the DSG. Equipped with a manual it takes 5.1.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > random001 07/07/2017 at 09:21

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Which one is a sedan?

random001 > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 09:37

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The Civic. Ok, maybe, technically, it could be called a liftback, but definitely not a hatchback.

Arrivederci > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 09:41

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Well, since the Golf R comes with a DSG, then its quickest 0-60 time is 4.5. Which makes it the fastest to 60 :).

Textured Soy Protein > theloudmouth 07/07/2017 at 10:28

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I get where you’re coming from. I also had an Integra GSR and since then have had 6 other vehicles all of which were rwd or awd, including a 135is and my current tweaked E92 335xi. At one point I chose a Mazdaspeed 6 over a Mazdaspeed 3 because after driving the MS3, I hated how it put power down and decided I wanted that motor with power going to the rear wheels, which the MS6 did, along with having a Torsen rear diff.

I haven’t driven a CTR (obviously) but I have driven a couple previous-generation Civic Si’s which have a similar differential and it definitely helps a lot. With the CTR, at least from what the reviewers are saying, Honda has done their best to engineer solutions around the common fwd issues.

theloudmouth > Textured Soy Protein 07/07/2017 at 11:05

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Our vehicular paths to today are fairly similar, and I fully agree on the impact of the differential, the difference it made on my 335is was astonishing. Honda has done an amazing job from all I’ve read as well, I just have the good fortune of a second car for all the nice weather days so my criticism of FWD vehicles is massively amplified since whenever I would be driving them it would be in far less than ideal conditions (my GTI admittedly is okay in dry weather, but irrelevant for me since it’s rarely driven as such, if I had more freeway driving regularly it’d be one thing, but for the type of commute and roads I have FWD is just a let down).

Jayhawk Jake > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/07/2017 at 11:07

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The advantage is AWD is more fun to drive than FWD. But RWD is the best so it’s a moot point anyways.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Arrivederci 07/07/2017 at 11:17

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Weren’t you concerned in your other post about making sure they were all equipped the same? Sounds like somebody wants it both ways...

Arrivederci > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather 07/10/2017 at 07:53

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What? That’s the fastest way they all come, right? Therefore, that’s the fastest each of them gets to 60.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Arrivederci 07/10/2017 at 11:32

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It’s about comparing them evenly.